Comments on: Permanent trespassers – a fan letter http://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/ Housing law news and comment Tue, 07 Feb 2012 09:56:35 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v= By: Jhttp://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/#comment-1464 J Wed, 19 Mar 2008 13:25:15 +0000 http://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/#comment-1464 And the Payne argument fails. http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Civ/2008/196.html And the Payne argument fails.
http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Civ/2008/196.html

]]> By: Jhttp://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/#comment-1463 J Thu, 13 Mar 2008 19:45:30 +0000 http://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/#comment-1463 Tony - that is really interesting. For those of us who follow the usual arguments of the usual suspects, can you confirm any of the following as regards the parties and their counsel?: Landlords 1) L&Q - ??? & Zia Bhaloo 2) KHT - Edward Bartley Jones QC & Michael Singleton Occupiers 1) Ansell - ??? & Matthew Feldman 2) White - Jan Luba QC & Adam Fullwood Government 1) Sec of State - Christopher Baker & ??? Tony – that is really interesting. For those of us who follow the usual arguments of the usual suspects, can you confirm any of the following as regards the parties and their counsel?:

Landlords
1) L&Q – ??? & Zia Bhaloo
2) KHT – Edward Bartley Jones QC & Michael Singleton

Occupiers
1) Ansell – ??? & Matthew Feldman
2) White – Jan Luba QC & Adam Fullwood

Government
1) Sec of State – Christopher Baker & ???

]]> By: Nearly Legalhttp://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/#comment-1462 Nearly Legal Thu, 13 Mar 2008 19:37:00 +0000 http://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/#comment-1462 Tony, you are very welcome to Nearly Legal. I'm going to do another post on Helena v Molyneux, which is getting a lot of interest around my way. I shall mention you acting in that. I didn't know Ansell had been joined with KHT v White. That is interesting. I think there is quite a lot of expectation that Payne v Cooper will be shoe-horned into the Lords hearing, although I can imagine it not being straightforward at this stage. I hope it is. Thanks for the date, though that is quite a while to wait, alas. Tony, you are very welcome to Nearly Legal.

I’m going to do another post on Helena v Molyneux, which is getting a lot of interest around my way. I shall mention you acting in that. I didn’t know Ansell had been joined with KHT v White. That is interesting. I think there is quite a lot of expectation that Payne v Cooper will be shoe-horned into the Lords hearing, although I can imagine it not being straightforward at this stage. I hope it is. Thanks for the date, though that is quite a while to wait, alas.

]]> By: Tony Fearnleyhttp://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/#comment-1461 Tony Fearnley Thu, 13 Mar 2008 12:18:46 +0000 http://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/#comment-1461 I acted for Mrs Mower and Mr Molyneux in the proceedings and was disappointed to say the least that Helena chose not to appeal ! However the payne v cooper point may be taken in the Lords in the case of london quadrant v ansell which has been conjoined with kht v julie white [i act for ms white] and which is to be heard over 3 days in october 2008 I acted for Mrs Mower and Mr Molyneux in the proceedings and was disappointed to say the least that Helena chose not to appeal !
However the payne v cooper point may be taken in the Lords in the case of london quadrant v ansell which has been conjoined with kht v julie white [i act for ms white] and which is to be heard over 3 days in october 2008

]]> By: Nearly Legalhttp://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/#comment-1460 Nearly Legal Tue, 11 Mar 2008 13:32:08 +0000 http://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/#comment-1460 Simon, It is utterly dependent on the wording of the order. I am involved in a permanent trespasser case at the moment that doesn't have the requisite phrase, alas. However, that wording was not uncommon in the post 2001 N28s as I recall Simon,

It is utterly dependent on the wording of the order. I am involved in a permanent trespasser case at the moment that doesn’t have the requisite phrase, alas. However, that wording was not uncommon in the post 2001 N28s as I recall

]]> By: Simonhttp://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/#comment-1459 Simon Tue, 11 Mar 2008 12:09:10 +0000 http://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/#comment-1459 It does rather depend on how the County Court office / District Judge worded the Order though!! From my experience they were not all worded the same, and were not all worded as plainly and conveniently as in the Helena Housing case, unfortunately. It does rather depend on how the County Court office / District Judge worded the Order though!! From my experience they were not all worded the same, and were not all worded as plainly and conveniently as in the Helena Housing case, unfortunately.

]]> By: Nearly Legalhttp://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/#comment-1458 Nearly Legal Mon, 10 Mar 2008 21:32:25 +0000 http://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/#comment-1458 Ditto on the cases, the jump from Payne (pre Rent Acts) to HA 1985 being all important and I haven't had a chance to consider it for myself. But the logic on the source of power to make the order is appealing. After all, if the court has no power to vary or discharge the order under s.85 once the arrears are paid off (the Marshall/Swindon etc. point), what is the source of the power to, in effect, permanently suspend the order as set out in that phrase? Ditto on the cases, the jump from Payne (pre Rent Acts) to HA 1985 being all important and I haven’t had a chance to consider it for myself. But the logic on the source of power to make the order is appealing. After all, if the court has no power to vary or discharge the order under s.85 once the arrears are paid off (the Marshall/Swindon etc. point), what is the source of the power to, in effect, permanently suspend the order as set out in that phrase?

]]> By: Jhttp://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/#comment-1457 J Mon, 10 Mar 2008 21:02:07 +0000 http://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2008/03/permanent-trespassers-a-fan-letter/#comment-1457 I'm just waiting to have enough spare time to sit down and go through the cases. If this argument works then it is very impressive indeed. I’m just waiting to have enough spare time to sit down and go through the cases. If this argument works then it is very impressive indeed.

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